Hans-Jurgen HEIMSOETH: Whatever can bring Ukraine closer to the European Union is good for us
Germany has been Ukraine’s reliable economic and political partner for decades. Ambassador Hans-Jurgen Heimsoeth once said that Germany has broad shoulders for this kind of role. The official German view on what’s happening in Ukraine is both friendly and critical, the latter being especially important, as it allows to view the situation from different angles. Ukraine’s rapprochement with Europe remains on the agenda, considering that it is one of the officially stated priorities. More on this in the following interview with Herr Hans-Jurgen HEIMSOETH, Ambassador Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary of the Federal Republic of Germany to Ukraine.
Mr. Ambassador, Germany proposes to tighten control over the financial policies of the EU countries, along with harsher sanctions in retaliation for breaches of the European stability pact to overcome the crisis, especially in the eurozone. Does this mean that Berlin will back the big EU federalization plan?
“A stable euro comes first, so this stability pact must be a clearly targeted and effective instrument to enhance economic and political consolidation. The sanctions included in this stability pact are meant to reach this goal — a larger number of mechanisms aimed at the stepping up of cooperating and strengthening the euro. I wouldn’t refer to the process as federalization, but that was the path upon which the EU had embarked. It has everything to do with cooperation.”
Does Germany visualize its postnational space within the EU frontiers?
“Nation-states are losing their importance. We’re facing big, complicated problems that can be solved only through combined efforts or by newly formed big alliances. Isolation also appears to be weakening these countries economically. The European Union operates on the sui generis principle. The [member] states gave up some of their sovereignty, above all in the trade sphere. In return, they kept their political sovereignty. The European Union will be part of the world’s most influential economic forces in the 21st century, on par with the United States and China. However, the EU is made up of both de jure and de facto member countries, among them Switzerland and Norway. Now this is where one can discuss something like a postnational space, although our nations continue to exist.”
How does Germany feel about French President Nicolas Sarkozy’s statement made during the Deauville Summit, about the new European security architecture? Where does Ukraine fit in?
“First, I believe that the relations between the European Union and Russia, and Ukraine, are of greatest importance for all of the parties concerned. The European Union attaches tremendous importance to all of Europe — with Ukraine and territories of Russia as its part — developing in one direction. It is important for us to have all values professed by the European Union to be held in esteem by one and all, so the kind of trade and cooperation being practiced by the EU will lead to well-being on this continent. In my opinion, Russia has its own interests to pursue, and is facing the mind-boggling task of modernization. I believe that these tasks are still to be solved. It is lagging behind in terms of competitiveness, most likely due to its command economy that fails to yield the expected results, with a markedly low innovative level. These problems will be placed on our agenda and I expect the talks with the EU to be effective. In this sense, Ukraine is up ahead; progress has been made in the talks about the Free Trade Area over the past several months. Ukraine, however, is also facing big challenges, primarily in regard to modernization and reform.”
Energy supply problems remain on the agenda. Russia is building a pipeline in the north and plans a bigger one in the south. Assuming that the Nabucco Pipeline remains the top priority, does Europe — and Germany in particular — need this southern pipeline, what with the market receiving an increasing amount of liquefied gas and the likely possibility of developing domestic shale gas fields? Does Berlin support Nabucco? Will you invest in this project?
“Gas supplies are very important for Germany and the rest of the European Union, and the latter has learned its lesson from the gas supply crisis. The sources and transportation routes must be diversified, but the key players of the game are not governments but companies willing to invest in new gas transportation projects. In regard to Nabucco, from what I know there is a German company interested in this project. There are also problems relating to Nabucco that remain to be solved. About the southern pipeline: I don’t know of any German companies taking an interest in this project, but I could be wrong.
“After the Ukraine-EU Summit, the impression is that Ukraine is moving in that direction using a one-way street, with only Kyiv facing requirements. In fact, the FTA deal demands that Ukraine secure Russia’s gas transportation to the EU, which should meet Ukraine halfway, in which case our rapprochement would be more likely. Germany’s role would be hard to overstate in this sense.
“All talks with the European Union are easier said than done. I was in Warsaw when the talks between Poland and the EU were in progress. You know, my impression is that this is a process where both sides have to meet halfway. If and when either of the sides fails to do so, it means that this side lacks will. Yet this is a wrong impression. All talks with the European Union have always been asymmetrical; there are many spheres in which the EU shows no progress; there are set rules and basic principles; all talks are about the transition time frame, quotas, and so on. It is important to understand that such talks and their outcome depend on making the FTA Agreement, if the country in question really wants EU membership. If it does, it has to get prepared to take part in a global competition. Turkey has gone through this, considering that an FTA Agreement was made with it more than 40 years ago. Talks are a complex process, so if we succeed in negotiating a free trade area deal next year, it will be a major success.”
New Year’s Eve is a moment to sum up the year. What about the relations between Germany and Ukraine? How do you feel about the Ukrainian government’s stated European integration course?
“I believe that our political relations have shown good progress over the past twenty years, and I hope they will be more dynamic in the economic sphere. This is something still to be achieved. Hopefully, the democratic achievements of the past couple of years will be upheld. For Germany, everything that gets Ukraine closer to EU membership is good, just as anything that can move it away is bad. We follow certain trends in Ukraine closely, particularly the education reform. It is important for us that your institutions of higher learning show progress in terms of quality, not quantity; that they adhere to the Bologna process, that they encourage students to learn other languages. The problem is not that few Ukrainians know Russian well enough, but that few Ukrainians know English and German. A great deal can and should be done to help Ukraine establish close contacts with European universities. All who closely watch the EU activities know that its Erasmus Mundus Program has introduced a lot of changes in the education sphere. A great many Frenchmen, Germans, and Spaniards spend some time training in other European countries.
“This helps create what you called a postnational space. This is especially important for the younger generation. They are nationals of their respective countries, but at the same time they become citizens of Europe.”
You have attended a number of cultural events in Ukraine. Was anything especially memorable?
“I was most impressed by my visit of the PinchukArtCentre where I could view contemporary masterpieces, considering that the objets d’art by such celebrated contemporary masters as Murakami, Hirst, Gurski, and Jeff Koons would attract public interest in New York City, for example. I’m happy to state that creative life is doing well in Kyiv — like the top-level Kofman music soirees at the National Philharmonic Society, or like all those folk choirs, and everything to do with folk music. Add here the Ukrainian pop groups where each musician can make his name, focusing on something.”
Germany’s Christmas dishes are known for their diversity, including Westphalia’s famous tender pork stew and cakes; mutton in Lower Saxony; eel soup and grilled sole in Hamburg; dumplings with goose in Thuringia; there are also the Leipzger Allerlel and Dresden cakes — the Christstollen is acknowledged across the world. How are you and your family going to celebrate Christmas and St. Sylvester’s Day in Kyiv?
“Mine is a German-French family, so we’ll celebrate Christmas with an eye to both the French and German tradition. The German one means a turkey, dishes made from wild game, Christstollen, or other home-made pastries. The French tradition spells buche de Noel [a light, airy vanilla-orange Genoise cake rolled and filled with classic French-style chocolate buttercream to make a traditional Christmas log – Ed.]. We’re planning to celebrate this Christmas the French way.”
Another traditional question: What would you wish The Day’s readers in the New Year?
“Stamina, more transparency; keep fighting and publicly exposing acts of corruption. Also, keep actively exercising your freedom of expression and assembly rights.”
