Johannes EBERT: “A nation’s culture is not merely fragments of old traditions but the whole contemporary world”

The Goethe Institute has existed in Kyiv for seven years, including over three years under the able guidance of Johannes Ebert. Ukraine is the first country where he is responsible for the implementation of German cultural concepts abroad (that is, support of cultural projects, teaching German, and providing comprehensive information about Germany). Mr. Ebert is also an active participant in the Ukrainian cultural process and by no means a bystander, so it was only natural that The Day’s round table should broach a variety of subjects, ranging from Ukrainian-German cultural exchanges to the development of modern Ukrainian art.

The Goethe Institute has existed in Kyiv for seven years, including over three years under the able guidance of Johannes Ebert. Ukraine is the first country where he is responsible for the implementation of German cultural concepts abroad (that is, support of cultural projects, teaching German, and providing comprehensive information about Germany). Mr. Ebert is also an active participant in the Ukrainian cultural process and by no means a bystander, so it was only natural that The Day’s round table should broach a variety of subjects, ranging from Ukrainian-German cultural exchanges to the development of modern Ukrainian art.

The Day: Quite a few people regard the Goethe Institute as a tool of German cultural expansion.

J. E.: I strongly dislike the very notion of cultural expansion. It is important to understand precisely the nature of the cultural policy being carried out by the German state. The interrelationship of cultures, cultural exchange, and mutual cultural enrichment are issues occupying a special place in Germany. We attach priority to the development of relationships, familiarization with foreign cultures, and comprehension of their distinctions, rather than just demonstrating our own cultural attainments. This policy safeguards international peace, and this is the kind of policy Germany has declared. This may sound like mere declarations and overly theoretical, but such a policy has real practical consequences.

Whenever we want to show something in Ukraine we display not what we would like to show but what we think Ukraine would want to see. That’s how we operate our branches all over the world. First we make inquiries in a given country and then work out a certain program. Modern art is one such aspect. When asked why we stage contemporary art exhibits so often, together with our partners (suffice it to recall the recent media art festival, Joseph Beuys, or a modern dance festival), I usually reply that the sphere of contemporary art in Ukraine is not that extensive and does not receive the kind of support it does elsewhere. Contemporary art in Ukraine needs other examples, other experiences to understand how its should further evolve.

On the other hand, we are less active in the sphere of classical art, because Ukraine has a great potential there and can offer a lot of its own, so it does not need German support. Yet in this domain, also, we try to show new European trends. For example, we brought a well-known harpsichordist, Andreas Steyer with his Bach program, since authentic medieval and baroque musical renditions are very popular in Western Europe, particularly in Germany (by authentic I mean compositions performed using original instruments). On the one hand, it is very interesting to listen to, and on the other, there are similar performing groups in Ukraine, so it is important to uphold creative and research contacts with foreign performers.

The Day: How is your institute interested in the Ukrainian cultural project in Germany?

J. E.: We take a very keen interest in this project, but I regret to say that our capabilities are limited.

The Day: Are you in any way influencing the formation of the Ukrainian Culture Days program in Germany?

J. E.: The formulation of a cultural program to be presented by Ukraine in Germany is not within our competence. We just provide technical assistance to the German and Ukrainian organizers as best we can.

The Day: A state cultural strategy is being actively worked out in Ukraine. There are two polarized views on how Ukrainian culture should develop. Some believe that the influence of other cultures, primarily Russian, should be restricted. Others are convinced that not blocking the influence of foreign cultures is the only way to make one’s own competitive. What are your perspectives on this discussion?

J. E.: I think you know my answer in advance. Organizations such as the Goethe Institute stand for cultural exchange. In our times of globalization it is very bad if a country withdraws into itself, closes itself off with an Iron Curtain or Berlin Wall. From what I can see in Ukraine as a young and developing state, it is searching for its own position. This problem is also relevant in Germany. While reviving the country after reunification, we are also trying to figure out who we are and where we now are in the world, especially in Europe. This is an immensely complicated and pressing issue. And culture always reflects such quests.

Of course, it is necessary to work out one’s own views and search for one’s own idea. But first you must know what Ukraine actually is. Looking only backward would be a mistake. Ukrainian culture has powerful roots and your classical arts are well developed (we have mentioned classical music). However, I would like to give you an example from German history. Forty years ago, we tried to find answers to similar questions. At the time Germany rose to the international level thanks to creative personalities such as artist Joseph Beuys, choreographer Pina Bausch, and writer GЯnter Grass. They tried to develop new aesthetics, often showing a critical attitude toward the German cultural heritage. Thus, GЯnter Grass, 1999 Nobel laureate, often lashed out at official West German policies. Of course, contemporary art has always coexisted with its advanced classical forms in Germany, but we succeeded in bringing our culture into focus precisely owing to this new trend. Getting back to Ukraine, I think that it is important to support not only the academic cultural spheres, but also contemporary art—and the latter does exist in Ukraine at a fairly high level. It is worth taking the risk of showing. This is also a part of a nation’s mentality, the more so that it addresses primarily young people, which is also very important for Ukraine.

To briefly sum up my answer, I say this: you have to determine your own identity. But, in my opinion, it would be a mistake to do so only by looking backward, to seek your cultural identity without taking into account new trends and current. A nation’s culture is not merely fragments of old traditions but the whole contemporary world with its processes of general openness and globalization.

The Day: How does the German state protect its culture?

J. E.: As far as I know, German culture does not protect itself from the impact of other cultures. We do not have a law prescribing German language quotas for radio and television programs. Of course, a Hollywood film director is not likely to receive any financial aid from the German state. On the other hand, we practice an open exchange, and this ensures quality. For example, the director of the Berlin Symphony Orchestra is of Italian parentage and my compatriot Kurt Mazur directs the New York Philharmonic. Strange things happen. We invited the Frankfurt Ballet Company led by the American Frederick Forsyth and discovered that the premier danseur was also an American. What was it? American or German culture? Well, we proceeded from the assumption that an American dancer or choreographer with his own creative concepts could only reveal their potential in the cultural environment of Germany.

German culture is distinguished by its international heterogeneity. I consider this a strong point. I am convinced that such international creative contacts can produce something new in terms of culture. We had a project called Far Reach, authored by Ute Weiss-Leder, a woman artist from Berlin, and her Kyiv counterpart Oksana Chepelyk. Working on the project, there were many discussions and even differences between the two, yet this is precisely what I believe made the project an extremely positive experience.

If I am not mistaken, your question basically relates to the presence of Russian culture and language in Ukraine. Well, it is difficult for me to say anything on the subject, because I have always believed that the more languages one knows, the better. Personally, I admire your equally perfect command of Ukrainian and Russian. Of course, language is a very important component of cultural self- determination. Also, I have noticed that very many people speak Russian in Ukraine and yet consider themselves to be Ukrainians, not Russians.

The Day: You have put together a nice collection of works of art and photos in Ukraine. Is that what you do in other countries as well?

J. E.: I am not a professional collector. I may go for a walk and drop in at an art gallery, meet painters, and buy a picture I like (if I have the money). There are many Ukrainian paintings I like (I have pictures by Zhuravel, Makov, and Yanovych; photos by Serhiy Bratkov and others), I can only hope there is enough room left on the walls of my apartment to hang everything I like and can afford.

The Day: How much do the personal preferences of the Goethe Institute’s director affect the process of shaping the Institute’s cultural programs?

J. E.: I hope I can work by properly adjusting my actions to the institute’s concepts. A program does not have to change every time there is a replacement in its top management. I would not be happy knowing that whoever takes over my post will do something altogether different than I did, but I don’t think this will happen.